Update on Storage node payouts

[tylkomat]

Since all of his nodes have different IPs couldn’t it be the case that he could hold all the pieces of some files. In this case a file would be lost forever.

[BrightSilence]

That’s exactly the probability I calculated there. If that weren’t the case there would be no chance of file loss.

I guess technically I would need the number of subnets… but I don’t think we have those stats. Lets just lowball it and say it’s 3000 subnets.

Still well above the 11 9’s of durability.

[mars_9t]

I was going to do similar calc, but from the point of “what’s the probability of choosing at least 52 nodes of that single SNO on upload” (80 - 52 = 28 which is less than 29 needed to survive). So let’s say I don’t have to do that anymore

[Knowledge]

As Bright Silence has pointed out, if a segment is lost the error correction allows nodes to recreate the lost segment. It doesn’t need to find a copy of it to copy it somewhere else, it simply rebuilds it. You need to lose a lot of segments to make it so any one segment could not be rebuilt.

[peter_linder]

This is very true.

Even if a whole country is (temporarily, we hope) offline with 1000’ nodes lost, the network will cope.

[nyancodex]

thanks for this, very useful information

[snorkel]

I calculated from the dashboard the total test data stored on my 9 nodes, on 11 march.
No node is full.
Total data stored: 56.8TB
Total test data stored: 7.3TB (13%)

US2 - 0.55% from all test data
SLTLAKE - 54.66% from all test data
EUNorth - 44.79% from all test data

% Test data from Total data stored per every node, according to their ages:
27 months - 28.2% (3.03 / 10.75TB)
23 months - 37.67% (FW off, 2 nodes/machine) (2.47 / 6.56TB)
10 months - 3% (FW off, 2 nodes/machine) (0.1 / 3.46TB)
15 months - 11.16% (0.9 / 8.12TB)
11 months - 5.01% (0.37 / 7.25TB)
10 months - 3.23% (0.23 / 7.02TB)
6 months - 1.87% (0.097 / 5.2TB)
5 months - 1.65% (0.076 / 4.63TB)
4 months - 1.59% (0.061 / 3.84 TB)

[nyancodex]

I see a clear trend on my nodes that test data is being replace time by time with real data.

[heunland]

Please read the OP again. Specifically, the answer to Q: What is the proposed path forward with SNO payments?

@john

Throughout this process we are committed to maintaining relatively stable aggregate SNO payouts through the addition of data and egress to the network. We plan to do this through our regular customer growth and also through the use of synthetic load (test data and egress) if necessary. In doing this we are targeting greater utilization of the network, hopefully getting closer to the network being 80% full so that SNOs’ drives will fill faster and produce higher returns over time. As our customer growth increases we will slowly remove this synthetic load until the network is operating completely without subsidy from Storj.

While adding synthetic load to the network does add cost It is important to note that right now our main concern is our unit costs. We need to get to the point where every TB of data that we sell earns us money instead of losing us money like it does now. This is why we need to make changes to the SNO payments (as well as to R/S numbers etc…) Once we are unit profitable then as we scale we become more profitable overall instead of less. Also, we plan to increase the synthetic load in step with any payout decreases such that the total amount we pay SNOs remains relatively constant. This means that overall the addition won’t increase our costs. It will just keep them flat until customer growth catches up.

[Alexey]

@nyancodex

does this mean dataloss?

unlikely, the expansion factor is 80/29, so you need to shutdown 52 nodes from 52 subnets /24 across the world to lose this segment. When the number of healthy pieces would be below 60 pieces, the repair job got triggered and will recover missing 20 pieces.

[AiS1972]

I absolutely don’t mind tightening the belt if the situation requires it.
BUT!
Let’s not be hypocrites.
If there is a plan to cut costs, then this should apply not only to the salaries of node operators, but also to the salaries of storj employees, naturally including dear John. In this case, I’m even ready to tighten two belts.
But not in the case when the storj employees are in a more privileged position in relation to the node operators.
Add more transparency to two components - payment for the work of node operators and company employees.
Mutual respect and transparency will remove unnecessary questions.

Sincerely yours dr Sans

[Alexey]

@AiS1972

but also to the salaries of storj employees

See

January 2023 Update from Storj

Storj places a high value on transparency, and we provide a number of resources to help the broader network understand the state of the network*. It is in this spirit that we are letting you know about some organizational changes, which will result in reducing our full time staff by 9 people, or about 12.5%. 2022 was an amazing year of growth for Storj, almost across the board. Our network and product made significant progress. In particular, we saw strong and consistent growth in customers, da…

[AiS1972]

Alexey!

You understand that we are not talking here about the reduction of 12.5% of workers.
I was talking about something else.
Any leader must start with himself.
I would be happy to see Ben and John’s statement.
Dear company employees and node operators.
We need to cut costs and therefore we are cutting the salaries of company employees and node operators by 20%.
And we, the leaders of the company, we cut wages by 25%.
It will be fair and will remove these unnecessary multi-page discussions.

[Alexey]

It will not remove the discussion. Every payout cut followed by the discussion, because we need to understand is there any other way to improve the situation?

However, the basic economic will not change - if you get money from the customers, you need to have some profit (even small) after all mandatory expenses include taxes. In the current situation there is no profit, only losses…

[andrew2.hart]

@AiS1972

If there is a plan to cut costs, then this should apply not only to the salaries of node operators, but also to the salaries of storj employees, naturally including dear John. In this case

I think you should ☆

[nerdatwork]

@andrew2.hart Please be respectful of other’s opinions. Everyone has the right to put forth their sentiments in a professional manner. Just because you or anyone else feels them unwanted does not mean you should use profanity to display your discontent.

The moment you think you might use such language, just take a long walk or get away from that topic. It’s good for your mental health in more than 1 way.

[nerdatwork]

Update about the Storj network stats after more than a month, about change in Payouts post.

Previously as of March 9, 2023.

Today April 15, 2023

There is rather an increase of 1000 nodes instead of any decrease.

[Alexey]

And this is what is how it should look like.
Respect.